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C-MAX Energi: Fuel Saving Tips and Tricks

fuel mileage driving tips

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79 replies to this topic

#61 OFFLINE   dr61

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 12:50 PM

Does anyone know how the C-Max calculates the 125.1 MPG in the above example?

It is showing only MPG, not MPGe; so it divides 41.8 miles by 0.3xx gallons.  Does not include the 5.2 kWh (unless you choose to display MPGe).









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#62 OFFLINE   ArizonaEnergi

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 01:23 PM

It is showing only MPG, not MPGe; so it divides 41.8 miles by 0.3xx gallons.  Does not include the 5.2 kWh (unless you choose to display MPGe).

Okay, but isn't that a meaningless number as it doesn't include the electrical energy used?  Isn't the true MGP 41.8-33.3 = 8.5/.3= 28.3 and why shouldn't it show that under MPG and use MPGe for the combined calculation?



#63 OFFLINE   honemch

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 04:11 PM

Total distance divided by gallons used. The gallons used that is shown in this display is rounded to the nearest tenth. The trip display will show you to the nearest hundredth.

#64 OFFLINE   jeffegg2

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 04:25 PM

I don't really understand what MPGe is. Suppose I drive in all electric? Does anyone know the formula? Wouldn't Gas/Electric equivilance depend on the price of gas and electricity? I try to look at is as well I get 22 miles, and what did it cost to get that charge, and what amount of gas at current prices take to get that far.....



#65 OFFLINE   dr61

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 04:57 PM

I don't really understand what MPGe is. Suppose I drive in all electric? Does anyone know the formula? Wouldn't Gas/Electric equivilance depend on the price of gas and electricity? I try to look at is as well I get 22 miles, and what did it cost to get that charge, and what amount of gas at current prices take to get that far.....

33.7 kilowatt hours of electricity is equivalent to one gallon of gasoline.  It has to do with energy, not money.  Article here:

http://en.wikipedia....line_equivalent



#66 OFFLINE   honemch

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 05:03 PM

You can tell your energi to display your efficiency in MPGe.

#67 OFFLINE   jeffegg2

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 03:13 PM

I would like it to display in miles per dollar in fuel spent.



#68 OFFLINE   smangerer

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:06 PM

It is showing only MPG, not MPGe; so it divides 41.8 miles by 0.3xx gallons.  Does not include the 5.2 kWh (unless you choose to display MPGe).

Im still new to this car but my MPG display climbs when Im in EV so Im not sure you are correct. I havent seen the option to display MPGe yet. 



#69 OFFLINE   dr61

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 10:48 AM

Im still new to this car but my MPG display climbs when Im in EV so Im not sure you are correct. I havent seen the option to display MPGe yet. 

MPG will always climb while driving in EV since miles go up while gallons used stay the same.

 

I don't have a car yet, but in the Owners manual PDF it says :

 

"For Energi vehicles, in the Display section of the Settings menu you
can choose your fuel economy units as Fuel only or fuel + electric.
When fuel + electric is chosen your electrical energy use during
Plug-in Power Mode is included in your instantaneous fuel economy.
This is based on its equivalent energy in terms of gallons or liters of
gasoline. The units will be displayed as MPGe, which reads miles per
gallon equivalent, and similarly, km/Le and Le/100km."



#70 OFFLINE   honemch

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 12:33 PM

Okay, but isn't that a meaningless number as it doesn't include the electrical energy used?  Isn't the true MGP 41.8-33.3 = 8.5/.3= 28.3 and why shouldn't it show that under MPG and use MPGe for the combined calculation?

 

This is a close calculation to true MPG for solely engine use. The problem with your calculation is that you are forgetting the regen miles that are generated while running on the engine. When your battery is depleted, you'll notice that your car charges up the 'hybrid' battery as you drive, and then turns the engine off and uses that battery power to run the car in EV... especially while coasting. Those miles are counted as EV miles in the display (but the energy that went into the battery to provide those EV miles came from gas). To get a true idea of MPG, turn the car off after the battery is depleted, then turn it back on and drive around. At the end of your trip you will get a true MPG reading. 



#71 OFFLINE   ArizonaEnergi

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 08:01 AM

Since we mainly drive our Energi in EV mode around town, the steadily increasing MPG number displayed is meaningless, so I'm going to switch to MPGe for perhaps some more useful information.

 

However, I am interested in how the much gasoline is used on long trips where the car will be in mainly hybrid-mode with the EV "portion" of the battery largely depleted.  For this and to compare to gasoline and other hybrid cars, I'm going to do this calcuation:

 

miles driven / (gasoline used + ((# of recharges x $0.75)/price per gallon))) = MPG

 

I will be taking a long trip soon (150 miles one-way, 300 RT) and will test this out.  The $0.75 comes from the electric rate in this area of about $0.11kWh and the time to typically recharge the battery 6-7 hours, rounded to a nice number.  For example, I see many C-Max hybrid owners get about 40 MPG, so using that in the formula assuming the Energi battery gives 20 EV miles for each segment results in:

 

300 / (260/40 + (2 x $0.75)/$3.50) = 300 / (6.5 + .4) = 43.5MPG  (Total cost $24.25 - compare to $48 in my Honda)

 

So under this calculation, the Energi battery would give a boost of 3.5MPG over the hybrid C-Max.  Does this seem like a rational calculation?  If so I will do it a few times, then later after the car has several thousand miles on the engine (if ever!?), but mainly just forget about it and drive the thing, enjoying fill-ups in my garage!


Edited by ArizonaEnergi, 19 March 2013 - 04:47 AM.


#72 OFFLINE   cmaxmd

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Posted 18 March 2013 - 06:07 AM

@dr61: Thanks for the instructions.  I was finally able to find how to set it to mpge, which was bugging me since I bought the car.  Looks like you can flip between mpge and mpg-phony (where electric is infinite mpg) at will.  My lifetime average for 1900 miles is 63.7; the mpg-phony was showing 102.4.

Another positive thing: on a particular 40 mile back road route, about half of which i'm averaging 60mph, other half is avging 45, i've been consistently getting 44 mpg entirely on gas per the screen.  This matches/beats the EPA sticker of 44/41 for the energi.  No way to verify this externally, unless i were to go 300 miles on gas with no charging, and check gallons from the pump.  

On the interstate I seem to match cr's 38, going about 70.

 


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#73 OFFLINE   smangerer

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Posted 18 March 2013 - 10:38 PM

Settings -> Display -> Units -> fuel Econemy.

 

I had to post it cause it took me a sec to find it. Im still unsure of which one is better to gauge... I would think that I would only want to see Fuel as a comparison to other cars. I also use to keep my MPG tabs from tank to tank on my old car and will have to wait to start on this car since I wont be getting gas often but Ill try MPGe and compare. 

 

 

@cmaxmd, your post confuses me. I am under the impression that the MPGe displays the 100plus numbers when the MPG displays numbers in the 60's. Im guessing since you wanted to switch to MPGe you are referring to the "phony" mode as the MPG? 


Edited by smangerer, 18 March 2013 - 10:56 PM.


#74 OFFLINE   CMXNRG

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 12:25 AM

125.1 MPGe?  What is the real mpg if the Lithium EV Now mode was used for ~20 miles of the trip 42 mile?  Hybrid 66.6 MPG? 

 

EDIT- ICE only  would be ~ 26.6 MPG?   Guesstimations all.

The display MPG is calculated as:

Total Miles/gallons used = MPG

41.8 miles / 0.3 gallons = 139.33mpg  WWHHHAAAATTTT!!!! you say.... There is a problem with only showing tenths of a gallon.

reverse calculate actual fuel use recorded

41.8 miles at 125.1 MPG = 41.8 / 125.1 = 0.334 Gallons. You can see things got rounded down and the inherent problem of doing short trip calculations.

 

Lets try MPG with this new fuel quantity for Hybrid miles:

(total miles - EV miles + regen miles) / gallons used

(41.8 - 33.3 + 2.8) / 0.334 = 33.8MPG    possibly???

 

How about MPGe for EV miles

(EV miles - Regen Miles) / Gallon equivalent

(33.3 - 2.8) / (5.2 / 33.7) = 197.7 MPGe    this seems high??? :banghead:

 

Ok lets try total miles MPGe:

total miles / ((gallons consumed + (KWH used / 33.7 equivalent))

41.8 / ((0.334 + (5.2 / 33.7)) = 85.6 MPGe   

 

Well there is some late night math for your consideration. From what I have seen on the forum we can only use MPGe as displayed by the car or calculated in the last formula as any kind of legitimate energy efficiency number. MPG displayed does not count energy from charging and would only be useful if a trip was conducted entirely in EV later or battery depleted situation. Any other attempted calculation is hard determine where the regen miles come in to play. Also how accurate is the Energy used totalizer for real determination of Energy efficiency?

 

However the displays are great at comparing your performance from this trip compared to last trip or weather or not I can beat Altabrig's best MPGe  :stirpot:  :ohsnap:


Edited by CMXNRG, 19 March 2013 - 12:26 AM.

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#75 OFFLINE   altabrig

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 09:17 AM

I think the 33 ICE and 85 mpge are more realistic.   Gotta change the display to MPGe. 

 

My wife came home at 70 mph last night,  MPG using the lithium was 79.something.  I don't even want to know the horror caused by that drag increase.  Yikes.

 

I imagine we will see some ridiculous high MPG display numbers on our Energis once the ICEs are broken in combined with the hot summer months.


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#76 OFFLINE   shaggy314

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 11:41 AM

You can also start using Fuelly.com to track pure miles for gallons used...



#77 OFFLINE   Ron Carter

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Posted 16 March 2015 - 08:00 PM

Hello everyone.

My 2015 Cmax Energi says 21 miles available when fully charged... does anyone else have different experience?



#78 OFFLINE   makiedog

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 06:19 AM

I get between 18 and 22 miles estimates for the HVB. My question to the group is this: after HVB is depleted and I turn off the car, the summary shows 4.7 - 5.7 kwh used, depending on the day. Why would this number vary? I get that the range estimate varies based on driving pattern, but why would the battery capacity vary? My '13 Volt will consistently show 10.4- 10.6 kwh at the end of a trip, which makes sense since the HVB capacity is fixed regardless of how you drive.



#79 OFFLINE   Tom_NC_1

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 09:24 AM

I get between 18 and 22 miles estimates for the HVB. My question to the group is this: after HVB is depleted and I turn off the car, the summary shows 4.7 - 5.7 kwh used, depending on the day. Why would this number vary? I get that the range estimate varies based on driving pattern, but why would the battery capacity vary? My '13 Volt will consistently show 10.4- 10.6 kwh at the end of a trip, which makes sense since the HVB capacity is fixed regardless of how you drive.

I watch the kWh used and noted that in colder weather there are less total kWh's available. I have to assume that this is due to lower battery efficiencies in cold weather. I also think that any kWh used for heat is not included in the trip summary but I could be wrong about that.  I got as low as 20 miles on an charge in cold weather and have noticed that I am already back up to 25+ miles per charge now that the weather is much warmer. The kWh used do seem to range similar to what you experience.  

My range indicator was also around 20 miles in the winter and yesterday with temperatures reaching 79ºF it hit 30 miles. Actual miles always varies from the range indication.

As far as the Volt is concerned there is much more battery temperature control so it make sense that there should be more consistent power output. At least that is my guess.

 

Tom



#80 OFFLINE   stevedebi

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 09:40 AM

Hello everyone.

My 2015 Cmax Energi says 21 miles available when fully charged... does anyone else have different experience?

The miles display is very misleading. For one thing, it is based on the amount of energy that was used previously. If you were gliding home for the last couple of miles it will show more. If you were running heat and A/C, it will show less.

 

Mine runs from around 22 to 36 normally. I've had it show as high as 44 after a particularly good stretch of energy efficient driving the day before.

 

EDIT: Note that on a good day in the 70's or 80's without A/C, I will get about 27 actual EV miles.


Edited by stevedebi, 17 March 2015 - 09:41 AM.










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