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No longer getting a full charge?

c-max batteries charging

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111 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   reedrinn

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 09:03 AM

I have about 25,000 miles on my 2013 C-Max Energi that was purchased in March, 2013.  I've been very happy with the car and have had only very minor issues to this point.

 

About two weeks ago, whenever the car notified me that charging was complete, I noticed that only three of the four segments of the light ring around the plug were illuminated.  Even if I left the car plugged in an extra hour or two, the fourth segment never lights up.  At the same time, i noticed that I was getting much lower predicted range, around 16 miles instead of the usual 20+, and my actual range also seems to be less by four or five miles.  I charge at three different locations almost every day (two are Level 2 chargers and the other is 110V) and the results are consistent at all three charge locations.  I started paying attention to the charge indication on the center display and it still shows 100% after a charge completes, and the the car sends me the desired text message indicating that the charge is complete.  

 

Has anyone else experienced anything like this?  Anyone have any ideas what is going on?  Of course, I suspect that the battery has gone bad.

 

Thanks,

-RR

 









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#2 OFFLINE   bro1999

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 09:33 AM

I have about 25,000 miles on my 2013 C-Max Energi that was purchased in March, 2013.  I've been very happy with the car and have had only very minor issues to this point.

 

About two weeks ago, whenever the car notified me that charging was complete, I noticed that only three of the four segments of the light ring around the plug were illuminated.  Even if I left the car plugged in an extra hour or two, the fourth segment never lights up.  At the same time, i noticed that I was getting much lower predicted range, around 16 miles instead of the usual 20+, and my actual range also seems to be less by four or five miles.  I charge at three different locations almost every day (two are Level 2 chargers and the other is 110V) and the results are consistent at all three charge locations.  I started paying attention to the charge indication on the center display and it still shows 100% after a charge completes, and the the car sends me the desired text message indicating that the charge is complete.  

 

Has anyone else experienced anything like this?  Anyone have any ideas what is going on?  Of course, I suspect that the battery has gone bad.

 

Thanks,

-RR

 

Sounds like there is some wrong, but before you take it to the dealer, I would do a simple test. The next time after a full charge, reset one of your trip meters and let your NRG deplete the battery fully before charging again. Once the battery is depleted, note what the kWh used figure is. If it was fully charged, the number should be around 5.4-5.5 kWh.

 

Also, have you noticed charge times being quicker than normal recently? That might be another sign the HV battery has an issue.



#3 OFFLINE   fotomoto

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 09:56 AM

What does your charge/trip log on MFM indicate?

 

I've dropped a few miles of indicated range too.  Warm weather is here.   :redcard:



#4 OFFLINE   reedrinn

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 11:04 AM

I'll work on the odometer/kWh and MFM results and see what I get.  Thanks for the advice.

 

-RR



#5 OFFLINE   honemch

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 11:19 AM

Could be the fourth quadrant of the light ring has died.

#6 OFFLINE   reedrinn

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 11:31 AM

Could be the fourth quadrant of the light ring has died.

 

I thought about that and will try to test that, as well.  I believe all four segments should blink sequentially when you plug in the charging cable or illuminate steadily when the door is opened.

 

-RR



#7 OFFLINE   GaryG

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 02:28 PM

You might want to try recalibrating the battery. I just did this by preconditioning the cabin with the A/C. Get in and leave the NRG pluged-in. Push on the brake and push the start button with the A/C on high. A message will display to unplug, but the car will run the A/C at this point. Watch the arrows above and below the battery level to see if it's charging or discharging. Wait till it begins to charge with the arrow up till it stops charging. Play no attention to the blue ring because my arrow still shows charging after the blue ring goes out sometimes.

 

My battery charged to 99.9% and the range on MFM and the dash showed 40 miles. I think the battery needs this recalibration every once in awhile. The computer in my Escape Hybrids re calibrated the battery in this manner, so it doesn't hurt anything and the battery last longer.

 

Gary 



#8 OFFLINE   TopherTheME

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 03:20 PM

As Gary G said the battery calibration could just be off. SOC is a very difficult and complicated thing to measure however SOC algorithms often re-calibrate after a full charge and balance. A battery recalibration may do the trick. Have you tried running a vehicle health report? What did it say?

 

Its also very possible that you just got a bad cell in you battery pack thats preventing it from being fully charged which sometimes happens.



#9 OFFLINE   rbort

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 06:42 PM

No disrespect but I don't call that recalibration of the battery.  I've done this before (run the AC and/or Heat) while charging in a parking lot on a chargepoint charger from my "home office" so to speak while surfing the internet. 

 

What happens when you run the AC and/or the heat power is drawn from the system and battery and basically the voltage drops due to the load and the car keeps charging because the voltage is not up to the set point where its supposed to be when the battery is full per Ford programming.

 

We know that the battery is not fully full where Ford sets the programming, so the battery this way will charge further, closer to 100% and when it does that the higher voltage will show more miles on the estimate of range.

 

You're not really calibrating anything but putting a load on the system causing the charge full detection system to get confused and keep charging thinking its not there yet.   Gary calls that supercharging the battery as he can see with the SGII that its higher charged than Ford normally allows.

 

This is OK if you plan to leave right away, but don't do it and leave the car sit.  The reason being is that when the temperature rises, for example the sun comes up the next day, the battery voltage will rise and the charge % will increase.  Ford leaves room in there to accommodate this, and just two days ago I noticed this I had the battery level at 66% the night before, the next day during the day when it was warmer out I jumped in the car and the charge level was up to 70%.  Just like that extra 4% from heat.  It will also drop the other way if its colder out.

 

Not charging the battery to 100% is by design since Ford cannot dictate what people do and some folks who live in hot weather are bound to fully charge their car overnight and perhaps let it heat soak the next day in the driveway (no garage) because there is no plan to go anywhere that day.  If the battery was at 100%, day after day with this the voltage will be higher than specs and cause small additive damage to the pack one day at a time.

 

100% on your screen is 90% is what I believe Gary said from the SGII readings so that gives and extra 10% of headroom without having the cells rise above 4.2v per cell.  As Gary says, he can get it up to 40 miles range by doing this (AC on while charging), and that's how he was able to drive the car 39.6miles on one charge while using hypermiling techniques.

 

Just my opinion and no disrespect to anyone, just remember we are all in this together and love these cars, I'm just trying to give you another point of view.

 

-=>Raja.


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#10 OFFLINE   GaryG

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 08:16 PM

No disrespect but I don't call that recalibration of the battery.  I've done this before (run the AC and/or Heat) while charging in a parking lot on a chargepoint charger from my "home office" so to speak while surfing the internet. 

 

What happens when you run the AC and/or the heat power is drawn from the system and battery and basically the voltage drops due to the load and the car keeps charging because the voltage is not up to the set point where its supposed to be when the battery is full per Ford programming.

 

We know that the battery is not fully full where Ford sets the programming, so the battery this way will charge further, closer to 100% and when it does that the higher voltage will show more miles on the estimate of range.

 

You're not really calibrating anything but putting a load on the system causing the charge full detection system to get confused and keep charging thinking its not there yet.   Gary calls that supercharging the battery as he can see with the SGII that its higher charged than Ford normally allows.

 

This is OK if you plan to leave right away, but don't do it and leave the car sit.  The reason being is that when the temperature rises, for example the sun comes up the next day, the battery voltage will rise and the charge % will increase.  Ford leaves room in there to accommodate this, and just two days ago I noticed this I had the battery level at 66% the night before, the next day during the day when it was warmer out I jumped in the car and the charge level was up to 70%.  Just like that extra 4% from heat.  It will also drop the other way if its colder out.

 

Not charging the battery to 100% is by design since Ford cannot dictate what people do and some folks who live in hot weather are bound to fully charge their car overnight and perhaps let it heat soak the next day in the driveway (no garage) because there is no plan to go anywhere that day.  If the battery was at 100%, day after day with this the voltage will be higher than specs and cause small additive damage to the pack one day at a time.

 

100% on your screen is 90% is what I believe Gary said from the SGII readings so that gives and extra 10% of headroom without having the cells rise above 4.2v per cell.  As Gary says, he can get it up to 40 miles range by doing this (AC on while charging), and that's how he was able to drive the car 39.6miles on one charge while using hypermiling techniques.

 

Just my opinion and no disrespect to anyone, just remember we are all in this together and love these cars, I'm just trying to give you another point of view.

 

-=>Raja.

 

You're being totally disrespectful, not only to me, but our Battery Engineer member. I've got news for you, I had a 27 mile battery range and did not supercharge before that 39.6 world record EV range in my Energi. You have used all of your credibility at this point, Good luck getting it back.

 

Gary.



#11 OFFLINE   rbort

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 06:24 AM

Gary:

 

It has nothing to do with credibility.  I said I'm just expressing my opinion an you need to relax again, remember last time you were getting all bent up out of shape and upset some people in the posts?  I'm quite calm and don't insult easy, other people might not take it so well.

 

When you say you are "recalibrating" the battery, it sounds like you are configuring something but you're not.  All you are doing is putting a load on the system while charging so it keeps charging further and brings up up closer to 100%.  If you "supercharge" like that as you call it and go use the battery, the next time you charge normally without having the AC on its going to go back to its original charge habits and stop charging at 90% or there abouts, calling that 100% on the car and MFM. 

 

On the lighter side of things, I got good news for you,  If you only had a normal charge when you did the 39 mile trip, then you have another task at hand, supercharge and do it again so that you can beat your own world record.  I'd bet in that case you should be able to get double the rated range of the Cmax of 21 miles or slightly better.  I've seen some pictures in the Ford Cmax setup videos I believe I forgot where, but it showed 6.1KWH used for the entire battery, not 5.5 or 5.7kwh.  I'm assuming that could have come when they charged the battery to 100% but then stopped that practice because they wanted the battery to last past the warranty period.

 

-=>Raja.


Edited by rbort, 30 May 2014 - 06:25 AM.


#12 OFFLINE   FordService

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 06:51 AM

I have about 25,000 miles on my 2013 C-Max Energi that was purchased in March, 2013.  I've been very happy with the car and have had only very minor issues to this point.

 

About two weeks ago, whenever the car notified me that charging was complete, I noticed that only three of the four segments of the light ring around the plug were illuminated.  Even if I left the car plugged in an extra hour or two, the fourth segment never lights up.  At the same time, i noticed that I was getting much lower predicted range, around 16 miles instead of the usual 20+, and my actual range also seems to be less by four or five miles.  I charge at three different locations almost every day (two are Level 2 chargers and the other is 110V) and the results are consistent at all three charge locations.  I started paying attention to the charge indication on the center display and it still shows 100% after a charge completes, and the the car sends me the desired text message indicating that the charge is complete.  

 

Has anyone else experienced anything like this?  Anyone have any ideas what is going on?  Of course, I suspect that the battery has gone bad.

 

Thanks,

-RR

 

RR,

 

I recommend having your dealer take a look at this. Send me a PM with your name, phone number, VIN, mileage, and dealer info. I'll see how I can help.

 

Ashley



#13 OFFLINE   GaryG

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 05:45 PM

Gary:

 

It has nothing to do with credibility.  I said I'm just expressing my opinion an you need to relax again, remember last time you were getting all bent up out of shape and upset some people in the posts?  I'm quite calm and don't insult easy, other people might not take it so well.

 

When you say you are "recalibrating" the battery, it sounds like you are configuring something but you're not.  All you are doing is putting a load on the system while charging so it keeps charging further and brings up up closer to 100%.  If you "supercharge" like that as you call it and go use the battery, the next time you charge normally without having the AC on its going to go back to its original charge habits and stop charging at 90% or there abouts, calling that 100% on the car and MFM. 

 

On the lighter side of things, I got good news for you,  If you only had a normal charge when you did the 39 mile trip, then you have another task at hand, supercharge and do it again so that you can beat your own world record.  I'd bet in that case you should be able to get double the rated range of the Cmax of 21 miles or slightly better.  I've seen some pictures in the Ford Cmax setup videos I believe I forgot where, but it showed 6.1KWH used for the entire battery, not 5.5 or 5.7kwh.  I'm assuming that could have come when they charged the battery to 100% but then stopped that practice because they wanted the battery to last past the warranty period.

 

-=>Raja

 

Look, you can't make up lies about me supercharging before a EV trip you don't know anything about. If you don't understand recalibrating a battery, don't assume me or  TopherTheME made up the term. You have no good news to me, so don't act as if you do. The weather was already chilly hear in Florida, so why run the A/C to supercharge? You are spreading total BS and lies you know nothing about. On the other hand, I produce documented results.

 

If the OP says my recommendation didn't work, he has a problem like TopherTheME said and must have a bad cell or two. Grow up, you are 47 years old and don't need to try to make a 59 year old look bad so you think you can look good.

 

Gary



#14 OFFLINE   sstober

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 09:42 PM

Chill all.....


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#15 OFFLINE   fotomoto

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Posted 31 May 2014 - 04:32 AM

Chill all.....

 

Agreed.  Let's stop with the personal attacks/comments and keep the focus on the discussion.


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#16 OFFLINE   TopherTheME

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Posted 31 May 2014 - 08:27 AM

No disrespect but I don't call that recalibration of the battery.  I've done this before (run the AC and/or Heat) while charging in a parking lot on a chargepoint charger from my "home office" so to speak while surfing the internet. 

 

What happens when you run the AC and/or the heat power is drawn from the system and battery and basically the voltage drops due to the load and the car keeps charging because the voltage is not up to the set point where its supposed to be when the battery is full per Ford programming.

 

We know that the battery is not fully full where Ford sets the programming, so the battery this way will charge further, closer to 100% and when it does that the higher voltage will show more miles on the estimate of range.

 

You're not really calibrating anything but putting a load on the system causing the charge full detection system to get confused and keep charging thinking its not there yet.   Gary calls that supercharging the battery as he can see with the SGII that its higher charged than Ford normally allows.

 

This is OK if you plan to leave right away, but don't do it and leave the car sit.  The reason being is that when the temperature rises, for example the sun comes up the next day, the battery voltage will rise and the charge % will increase.  Ford leaves room in there to accommodate this, and just two days ago I noticed this I had the battery level at 66% the night before, the next day during the day when it was warmer out I jumped in the car and the charge level was up to 70%.  Just like that extra 4% from heat.  It will also drop the other way if its colder out.

 

Not charging the battery to 100% is by design since Ford cannot dictate what people do and some folks who live in hot weather are bound to fully charge their car overnight and perhaps let it heat soak the next day in the driveway (no garage) because there is no plan to go anywhere that day.  If the battery was at 100%, day after day with this the voltage will be higher than specs and cause small additive damage to the pack one day at a time.

 

100% on your screen is 90% is what I believe Gary said from the SGII readings so that gives and extra 10% of headroom without having the cells rise above 4.2v per cell.  As Gary says, he can get it up to 40 miles range by doing this (AC on while charging), and that's how he was able to drive the car 39.6miles on one charge while using hypermiling techniques.

 

Just my opinion and no disrespect to anyone, just remember we are all in this together and love these cars, I'm just trying to give you another point of view.

 

-=>Raja.

 

I don't mean to continue or start a "flame war" by any means but there a few things you stated that need correcting.

 

First, with regards to what is actually meant by "calibration" you are correct in that none of the actual calibrations in the vehicles BMS or HCM are being modified. At the heart of common types of SOC (and SOH) algorithms is an equivalent circuit model of the cells of the battery pack. I don't know if this is the approach Ford uses but I'm assuming it is since most other SOC methods tend not to work with <5% accuracy over the life of the vehicle. In a nutshell its a network of resistive and capacitive elements (and sometimes inductive) that define the electrical behavior of the pack. Over time the values of these elements change and need to be updated, which is done with measurements of voltage, temperature and other values like dV/di and measured capacity from coulomb counting. For example, coulomb counting is basically just measuring the current over time and integrating it to get capacity. This is a very commonly used and reliable method however its accuracy is dependent upon the frequency at which current is measured. A normal drive cycle has many large and fast transients which may not be accuratly captured depending on the measurement hardware and software. So by placing a (relatively) constant discharge load from an AC compressor or heater, and then charging the battery with a controlled current allows for a more accurate capacity measurement which is then used to update the elements in the equivalent circuit model. Theres obviously a lot more too it than that but just an example what happens when the BMS is "recalibrated".

 

Second, cell open circuit voltage doesn't increase with temperature, it decreases. If you have a background in thermodynamics and electrochemistry I can explain it if you want or you can just wiki the Nernst equation. The reason for the increase in voltage (and measured SOC) while you let the car sit is due to voltage relaxation. When a battery is discharged an ionic gradient is formed in the electrolyte which decreases the cell's voltage. When you let the battery sit without a load on it those ions in the electrolyte diffuse back to equilibrium increasing the cell voltage. The opposite happens when a cell is charged.

 

On another note, I don't really know what "supercharging" is so I will just say that if it is indeed a way of tricking the BMS to allow cell charging over the normal operating SOC window I would highly advice against doing it. Max SOC isn't just determined by a cell's cycle and calender life but for its safety as well.


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#17 OFFLINE   GaryG

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Posted 31 May 2014 - 11:24 AM

"On another note, I don't really know what "supercharging" is so I will just say that if it is indeed a way of tricking the BMS to allow cell charging over the normal operating SOC window I would highly advice against doing it. Max SOC isn't just determined by a cell's cycle and calender life but for its safety as well."

 

I made the term "supercharging" up when I discovered preconditioning when plugged-in. The OEM SOC gauge is not very accurate, so I have posted how to program a Scangauge II to read SOC, Cabin Temperature, and Battery Temperature among other gauges for the Energi. If you don't have a SGII W/ Xgauge programming, you can't read those important gauges properly. The Energi can charge up to 99.9% while preconditioning, but you cannot see this with the OEM SOC gauge. You can't charge the HV battery any higher than 99.9% by tricking the system and preconditioning is recommended in hot or cold weather. Many here do it with MFM, so if Ford wrote the software to program preconditioning while plugged-in, so there should not be any problems with it.

 

As you stated, SOC does not get higher in hot weather, so the theory that the cells reach a higher SOC is bogus. You and I know SOC decreases a little if anything while resting. Ford advises you start your EV trip just after a full charge for this reason. The EPA waits 24 hours after a full charge, so the battery has time to adjust before testing. 

 

The Energi only has fans for cooling the battery from outside air until you turn on the cabin A/C. Charging while the cabin air is on high helps thermal balance the cells better in hot weather, hence why I call it supercharging. Most people have reported a 2-3 mile increase in battery range. I only charge the battery with cabin A/C about 3% from a full SOC, and sometime less than that. If the battery is full, it will discharge while running the A/C while plugged-in to about 98. 5%, and begin charging again. This all takes about 10 minutes before my trip, so most of the time I don't have time for it. In general, my SGII SOC reads 89.9% - 99.4% SOC after a full charge without preconditioning. Supercharging will raise the SOC between 99.4% - up to 99.9% in hot weather. No need to run the heater here in Jupiter FL. Last summer, my battery was getting to as high as 111F with the cabin A/C on near the system limit of 113F where EV will shutdown. When I started preconditioning, my battery stayed under 104F in 92F outside temperatures.

 

The maximum range in hot weather with preconditioning before a trip and with the A/C on during the trip is 33.9 miles for me. With no preconditioning and no cabin A/C, I went 39.6 miles in cool weather here. I see no benefit in cooling a battery below 78F when I have colder outside weather.

 

Gary   



#18 OFFLINE   rbort

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Posted 31 May 2014 - 09:37 PM

Hey guys nobody is starting any flame wars here, just trying to explain my thoughts and ideas to folks here and you guys can take what you want from them or discard as needed if you disagree.  

 

I'm no chemist but I am an engineer, and I do understand several things though I may not be an expert on everything.  We all learn something every day.  Your explanation sounds complicated for the average Joe Topher.  Let me explain it in my terms and you let me know if you agree or not.

 

First off, I do understand and know that when you let batteries sit after a drain, the voltage will rise.  However, I believe there is a different scenario that causes battery voltage to rise with heat and drop with cold.  I don't know the exact chemical explanation for it, but I know about it from my hobbies and have seen it on my Energi.  I could leave the car tonight (unplug from charging say at 50% charge and tonight is 40 degrees.  Tomorrow the sun comes out and the charge level will be higher, like say 55% for example.  I can post specifics later.  I have also seen the charge drop from 55% where I left it one day, to 45% the next day when the temp outside was a high of 48 degrees just a couple of days ago.  What's your explanation of that (and not counting the relaxation point, that I already know of and agree with).

 

As far as the supercharging that Gary calls it, here is my explanation of that in simple terms.  Assume the Li-ion battery voltage range goes from 3.7v dead to 4.2v at 100% full.  You never want to exceed those limits and you really shouldn't use up a Li-ion or Lipo pack below 20% capacity or say 3.73v per cell.  Anyways, given this, let's assume Ford decided to limit charge to 90% which is I don't know the figure off the top of my head, say for example 4.1v.  The system charges the pack until the cells reach 4.1v at which point it stops charging and it shows 100% full but its really 90% as seen in the SGII.  

 

Now if Gary turns on his AC while charging, that draws some power from the system and will drop the cell voltage to 4v (for example, don't get caught up on exact numbers, just illustrating).  The AC pulls about 1.5kwh but the high voltage charger pumps in 3.3kwh, so there is more charge going into the battery while the AC is on.  The voltage will rise under load of the AC slowly from 4v up to 4.1v, at which point it shuts charging off and says 100% again, but the AC is still ON.  Now Gary turns off the AC and unplugs the charger, and the load is gone, and the cells will bounce up to 4.2v per cell and the car will still show 100% but SGII will also now show 99.9% instead of 90%.  By using the AC load on the system, Gary has fooled the charging system into thinking the cells are not up to 4.1v yet and it continues to charge more with the load of the AC until it brings the voltage up to 4.1v with the AC running hence you have "supercharged" the pack or in reality just defeated the safety margin than Ford put in to make room for voltage rise when "fully" charged and soaking in the hot sun in Arizona for example.  Lipo or Li-ion packs you never really want to store at full charge, best stored at 60% charge or about 3.95v per cell.  Anyway, forget about storage charge, that is for long term storage while not in use and usually shipped in this range, but I believe what I explained above here is easy for the average person to understand.  

 

I was going to ask you guys what you do mean when you use the word recalibration because I didn't think anything was being recalibrated, but I believe you answered my question anyways and agreed that its not.  

 

By the way, I went to Derry NH today and back.  Check out my stats below.  65 mph on the highway, 53mph tops using the battery.  I didn't follow the higher SOC theory (save battery until the end), but used the battery before, during and after using the gas engine.  It worked out really well for me, pretty good stats, and I got a full charge on the HVB at both ends.  There was 3% left of the HVB when I got home, disregard the 7 miles you see, I'm charging it now since I got back.

 

-=>Raja.


Edited by rbort, 31 May 2014 - 09:40 PM.


#19 OFFLINE   GaryG

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Posted 01 June 2014 - 03:06 PM

You still don't get it rbort, do you? Supercharging is a name I made up for Ford's own patent and explained in a SAE article by Ford Engineers that I've posted here over and over for a year now. Let me just copy and paste from the patent with a link:

 

"Various embodiments according to the present disclosure have associated advantages. Regulating the battery temperature permits both a larger amount of energy to be stored in the battery when charging and more available energy from the battery when operating due to the battery chemistry. Conditioning the battery to a specified temperature while the vehicle is charging causes higher energy efficiency later for the vehicle as less battery energy may be needed to thermally manage the battery and more may be directed for propulsion, thereby extending the vehicle range. Conditioning the cabin to a specified temperature while the vehicle is charging causes higher energy efficiency later for the vehicle as less battery energy may be needed to heat or cool the cabin and more may be directed to propelling the vehicle, also increasing the vehicle range."  http://patents.justi.../patent/8620506

 

Gary



#20 OFFLINE   TopherTheME

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Posted 01 June 2014 - 07:48 PM

"On another note, I don't really know what "supercharging" is so I will just say that if it is indeed a way of tricking the BMS to allow cell charging over the normal operating SOC window I would highly advice against doing it. Max SOC isn't just determined by a cell's cycle and calender life but for its safety as well."

 

I made the term "supercharging" up when I discovered preconditioning when plugged-in. The OEM SOC gauge is not very accurate, so I have posted how to program a Scangauge II to read SOC, Cabin Temperature, and Battery Temperature among other gauges for the Energi. If you don't have a SGII W/ Xgauge programming, you can't read those important gauges properly. The Energi can charge up to 99.9% while preconditioning, but you cannot see this with the OEM SOC gauge. You can't charge the HV battery any higher than 99.9% by tricking the system and preconditioning is recommended in hot or cold weather. Many here do it with MFM, so if Ford wrote the software to program preconditioning while plugged-in, so there should not be any problems with it.

 

Gary   

 

 

OK, makes sense. Although the term "supercharging" is a bit misleading but I know what you mean.










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